Radar Chartplotter confusion

[kolive]

OK, I'll admit that I am pretty ignorant here and need some help. We
just bought our 1970 A25 and want to add a radar/chartplotter to it. The
more I look at brands and ads the more I get confused. Ebay is
interesting and scary at the same time. We cruise the PNW and want to
keep things simple, like the rest of the boat. But I also don't want
to end up wishing we'd got something else. I seem to be ending up
looking at Garmin, Furono and JRC in no particular order. The boat
currently has a Garmin handheld 76 and our last boat had a Garmin 192C
chartplotter. Of course budget is a factor as we are needing a trailer
as well and the boat budget seems to be taking some pretty healthy hits.

So, can folks please reply with ideas and feedback on what they have,
costs and what they'd like to see in a unit like this? 2kw, 4kw? I
have read MANY posts from the past and still remain confused, or maybe
its cautious anxiety.............

I posted to the Yahoo Albin owners site as well to try and get suggestions.

Nice luxury to have the benefit of both forums and expertise from all.

We finally get to take her out on our own as the new owners the weekend
of April 25th. A short trip into the San Juan's is our plan.

Thanks,

Keith

[RicM]

The first thing I would tell you is be VERY careful on eBay, and not for the usual reasons. Over on another forum "The Hull Truth" there was an extensive thread by an owner who had bought, I believe, a Garmin unit on eBay. He had technical problems with it and the manufacturer would NOT HONOR the warrantee, even though the seller was a bona fide brick & mortar Garmin retail dealer. See:
http://www.thehulltruth.com/forums/thre ... 1#M1842570
Be absolutely certain that the manufacturer will honor the warrantee on equipment sold over eBay! That does not mean not to buy online, I bought a bunch of stuff from BOE that has their own forum on "The Hull Truth" and they were very good with both price and customer service. You may want to stick with someone similar on the West Coast, however.
That said, there are a number of factors to consider. Are you rough water, hard core cruisers? If not, a 2K radar is probably fine if you only expect to be out in the fog once and a while. 4K adds range and definition, but to be honest I seldom use my radar at more than 1 mile range. I've had both and for safety only (not looking for birds or weather) I think 2K is fine. If your available mounting real estate is limited, and most Albins less that 30' were not really designed for extensive electronic installations, a combined networked 7" screen unit like the Furuno NavNet2 series is a good choice. A single screen with multiple sensors that can be added as you have $$ is a good way to go. You may already have a sounder/fishfinder for example, but when it gets cranky or the budget recovers you can add a Furno transducer and network sounder and combine that function into the chart plotter/radar. There's also satellite weather (& music) that can be added later. If you have a lot of commercial shipping in your area, you can add AIS at a later date as well.

As far as what brand to buy, that's a function of $$$. Furuno is more expensive, although they have just introduced NavNet3 and are offering good rebates on NavNet2 gear which they claim they will not be discontinuing. Go to the commercial dock near you and look into the helms on the fishing boats. 90% will have Furuno radar in them. That tells you something.

That said, Furuno, which I have, has really obtuse owner manuals that appear to me to be translated from Japanese (sometimes humorously poorly). The interface on the units, for example switching between 2 screen layouts, could be streamlined. I have never had a malfunction of my NavNet1 equipment and I am upgrading to a 10" screen from the NavNet2 line and all the existing sensors on the network function with the new gear except the radar dome (4K) and when I have $$ to replace that I can buy a 4K open array (next step up) and just plug it in. I also use a Garmin 76 handheld for a backup and in the car, they are great little units.

Shopping for electronics is probably the second biggest and most expensive decision you'll make. The good news is that todays equipment is well made, easy to operate, and actually a great bargain compared to what was available 10-20 years ago.

[kolive]

Ric,

Thanks for the detailed reply. I had not considered the gurantee question over ebay purchases. We have been looking at the Furuno units with addition capabilities and also the garmin for the same reason. The advice for the 2k/4k helps us a lot. Our usage will most likely be the fog we will encounter on occassion and also want to use it regularly to become familiar and comfortable reading it. I have an email out to a Marine Elecronics company in the port where we are moored to work with their recommendations for our boat. I appreciate your feedback and will use it in our decision.

Keith

[AlanD]

From the folks I have spoken to, the 2KW unit sufices for most applications. I have the 4KW Radome on my Raymarine set-up, so I could pick up birds working bait with the right settings. ((NOT what you need for safe navigation, but comes in handy chasing critters on the water.))

I bought all my Raymarine stuff via West Marine and never had an issue, no complaints from the Sonar, Radar, GPS, Auto-Pilot, all works well and easy to navigate. Also found the best prices on West Marine, when I looked around. They sell other brands as well.

[kolive]

Thank you for the input. I decided to use my existing Garmin 192C Chartplotter and buy a stand alone Furuno Radar unit. I am in process of installing it now.

Thanks,

Keith

[Doug]

I am a big fan of Garmin. On our 32+2, we have a Garmin 3010C, which has a 10 inch screen. I re-arranged the instument panel so this unit fits just above the steering wheel. The big advantage of Garmin is its ease of understanding and use. I receintly added a Garmin GMR 18 Radar to this unit. This gives the ability to overlay the radar on top of the chartplotter, which is very useful. My second choice would be the Ray Marine products, although I understand the learning curve is somewhat longer.

I really like the latest 5000 series Garmin Chartplotter products. They have done away with most of the buttons and it is all touch-screen. Instead of saying I want to go from this mark to that mark to the next mark, you just say I want to go from St. Petersburg to Ft. Myers and it figures it out. It is using the same type technology the Garmin Nuvi uses for the automobile navigators.

Doug

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[rnummi]

I read the above thread and was wondering what everyone is currently using? I have a dead eagle 5 inch screen with a missing transducer. I'll say at the outset I'm not worried about warranty I'm definitely looking for used. Not being an electrical professional like Don... Are there certain gotcha's to watch out for? Example buying a nmea 2000 vs 183? Can you mix and match or should one keep to one brand? I'm definitely lurking on ebay/CL/classifieds for Garmin. I think about 500 is my max. Smacksman's Lowrance review on YouTube convinced me to get a Garmin. Another post said you can't update the older units? Another observation, there isn't a lot of real estate on an A27. Is there a sweet spot size wise for our boats? Can't see plugging a 12 inch Chartplotter up there.

[joebuz]

I have a Garmin 5212. The 12" screen fits well just to left of wheel, up behind the windshield. Came with the boat that I bought about a year ago... so I'm still playing and learning the system. I've used a Garmin handheld for years so this thing blows my brain. However, so far all is good.

[Jeremyvmd]

You def want nmea 2000 comparability. While NMEA 0183 is still used (mostly by garmin) nmea 2000 is def a better system. I prefer navico to all others. I've had Garmin and it's decent but the usability and tech in the navico units is IMO superior. I would stay away from raymarine. Lots of boats use them but they have lots of issues. Even my dad who was a huge raymarine user and swore by them for lots of years has made the switch to navico. You can mix and match with nmea 2000 which is nice and it's super simple to setup a backbone rather than having to setup your talkers and listeners of the 0183 network. Honestly with a 500-600 dollar budget you can do pretty good even with new depending on what you want. While everyone wants the big screen the question is do you need it? On my 20 footer I have a 7" simrad and a 5" garmin that I use as a stand alone chart plotter and that is plenty. Unless your adding radar, honestly a 10" screen will likely be overkill. Even with running my instruments through the simrad on the little boat the 7" screen is perfect. I haven't found myself wanting or needing larger. You would be better served getting a newer small unit rather than an older large screen.

[rnummi]

Started looking at Navico products today. Think I'm in the hunt for a GO 7, seems to have all the bells and whistles for my price point. Thanks for the heads up on nmea 2000. Starting to make more sense to me now. Can the Simrad/B&G use the high graphics charts similar to G2 charts? I've got the boat on the hard, does it make sense to plug in a through hull transducer or stick w the stern mounts? Since you were advocating Navico, is there any diff between the straight GO7 and the xsv version?

[Jeremyvmd]

I have a strait go7, it was replaced by the xsv. I would try to get the new version as it supports side scan and all the newer transducers (including forward scan iirc) while the older go7 does just down scan. A stern mount will be cheaper, and on a a27 I think more than enough. Yes the simrads use high end charts. Pretty much any aftermarket chart except for the garmin ones. Im a fan of both the high end insight charts as well as the navionics charts

[rnummi]

Well, I ended up finding a Garmin 4212, a GMR 21 radar, a GSR 22 sounder, airmar P66 triducer, GPS 19, Xm weather and audio on CL for 1500. All tested and updated. Now to start rewiring and installing.