Shifter Detents and Morse cables

[Plum76]

So, new issue on my boat, just in time for the end of the year. The cable stop on my Morse cable (modifies earlier by PO) came un-JB welded and I lost reverse.

I’m fixing the mount properly, but with the travel I seem to have available in my Morse cable (2-3/4” roughly) I don’t seem to have enough to seat my shifter detent pin (the spring loaded one on the arm) into either forward or reverse. I can feel the ‘shift’ of the shifter prior to reaching the detent position, but seems like I should be all the way into the detent for proper operation?

Doing research on Morse cable adjustments now, but any tips? Seems like I need a longer arm on the shifter to match up cable travel to shifter travel..

Thanks

Jason

[nebulatech]

Hey Jason, I don't remember your motor. If it's an MD17C, I can dig out my controls and cables to see if they are of help. I have really busy weekend with family in town, so it may take a bit

[dkirsop]

I believe he has an AD21 same as me. Jason, can you post a photo showing the problem? It might take a day but when I next go down to my boat I'll take a few photos of my setup to see if they are any help to you. You can get a little bit of additional cable travel by using the adjusters at the Morse connection end too. When everything is set correctly the detents in the shift lever on the transmission will seat into their pockets.

[Plum76]

Sorry, it’s the stock AD21. I’m suspicious that I do t have the original shift lever, what I’m looking at is a 3-4” shift lever, not the longer extended lever I’m seeing in the spares catalog/owners manual, which makes the bodge on the cable stop more obvious.

I’m seeing (I think) a shorter distance between detents on the stock mount too, my arm needs to travel about 3.25” from forward detent to reverse detent, whereas I only have 2 3/4” of cable travel, yet it seems to engage the transmission earlier than the detent position(s). I think I’m in gear with the transmission, but not sitting in a detent..

Eh, another winter project.

Jason

[Plum76]

I have trouble posting pictures to this forum, but this video posted by a PO is my boat/engine. You can kinda see the short shift lever if you’re looking for it:


https://youtu.be/nxxyyGSW7NY

Jason

I believe he has an AD21 same as me. Jason, can you post a photo showing the problem? It might take a day but when I next go down to my boat I'll take a few photos of my setup to see if they are any help to you. You can get a little bit of additional cable travel by using the adjusters at the Morse connection end too. When everything is set correctly the detents in the shift lever on the transmission will seat into their pockets.

[dkirsop]

It looks like your transmission is equipped with the "new" style shifter mechanism which is more compact than the "older" style. Not sure I cam be of much help but I will take some pictures and post travel measurements. The Morse control is identical though so the cable should still have the same range of travel available to you.

I had shifting issues when I first owned my boat. The shifting action at the helm was very stiff and interfered with movement at the transmission. I replaced the cable and the action became very smooth and positive. The old cable was simply worn out and the stiffness resulted in a lot of lost motion. Something to ponder.

[Plum76]

Thanks, I appreciate any photos of stock or near stock setups. I'm pretty sure my transmission had the taller shift linkage originally, as the linkage cable bracket (that bolts to the housing forward of the shifter linkage) is fairly tall, as if it would have been used for the taller linkage. A prior repair had a metal ruler JB Welded lower on the mount to get a decent approach angle for the current shifter linkage and cable arrangement, but that broke loose (no surprise) and I was left without reverse. No idea why linkage would have been changed, unless prior one was damaged or faulty, and why if replacing you'd bother reinventing the wheel with a different style, but here we are.

I'm in the process of fitting a new cable stop/mount, but it's not terribly fast, the boat is out on a mooring, so I take some measurements, make some parts, go fit them, bring them home, modify and repeat. I'm going to get my cable end secured and aligned properly, then see where I can 'fix' the rest of the housing to take the waggle out of it, then work my way back up to the shifter to see where I can make adjustments. Perhaps by just getting things properly tied down and secured, I might see the additional travel i need to hit my detents. Short of seeing that come to fruition, the older style linkages appear to be available, can always go back to stock over the winter.

Cable action seems smooth, I think they've been replaced sometime recently, and shifter linkage seems to move freely (as freely as I expect mechanical linkages to feel anyway), so my next step after getting things tied down will be to investigate adjustments on the shifter end, to see if I can remove end play (shifter travel prior to cable travel) and eke out a bit more travel. Perhaps there is a further cable position to increase the pull I can utilize, haven't had much of a chance to get into it. The boat is getting pulled in the next week or so, and once it's at the house I can do some more investigating, just would be nice to have forward and reverse for getting it to the pump out one last time and to the launch for trailering. I can always shift the transmission by hand with the engine cover open, but obviously less than ideal.

Where are you all hosting images for use here, seems I need to get that sorted so I can better share my end of things?

Thanks again.

Jason

It looks like your transmission is equipped with the "new" style shifter mechanism which is more compact than the "older" style. Not sure I cam be of much help but I will take some pictures and post travel measurements. The Morse control is identical though so the cable should still have the same range of travel available to you.

I had shifting issues when I first owned my boat. The shifting action at the helm was very stiff and interfered with movement at the transmission. I replaced the cable and the action became very smooth and positive. The old cable was simply worn out and the stiffness resulted in a lot of lost motion. Something to ponder.

[Plum76]

Trying out some photo hosting:



Jason

[Plum76]

Bracket progress, using aluminum angle on hand:



New bracket is much lower, utilizes both bell housing holts, will be slotted to allow fore/aft adjustment, and arm drilled to catch the notch on the Morse cable housing..

Jason

[Plum76]

Mostly finished bracket. Have slotted the bellhousing mount bolts and drilled them three positions for the small angle cable holder, to allow for fine tuning positioning.





Jason

[dkirsop]

The full movement at my shift lever where the cable connects is 68mm. Neutral to forward is 34mm and neutral to reverse is 34mm. The bracket which connects the cable to the shift lever is made from sheet aluminum as the original bracket was missing when I purchased this motor. I have a spare engine with the original brackets which I used as patterns to ensure all parts were aligned in fabricating the bracket.

The bracket also holds a relay that sends power to the heaters installed in the manifold. If you search this site for Glow Plugs for and AD 21 you can find more info on this modification.

General Arrangement with Air Filter.jpeg

Shift Linkage.jpeg

Bracket Details.jpeg

Engine - Top View.jpeg

Engine - Front View.jpeg

Morse Linkage.jpeg

There is about 15mm of adjustment available at the Morse linkage connection using the barrel nut. Don't drop the screw or you will be on an archeological dig! I usually place a towel underneath to catch it when it drops.

[Plum76]

Alright, thanks for those photos, helped with some adjustments and I think success in full range.

Here’s where my bracket ended up:





Pretty good alignment, seems rigid enough, cable housing run nice and gentle, I think good here.

Was still just a bit short of forward detent with the new setup, so I pulled the head of the cable, put a few turns on it and moved it one more position outboard on its lever at the shifter (with the serrated index in the back). Now I’m here with my shifter before I engage the injection pump on the shifter:

Sorry, upside down..

I think I’m there!

Thanks for input!

Jason

[dkirsop]

Looks like you have solved your problem. I wouldn't bother replacing the mechanism if it works well. One of the boaters up here had the shorter unit and in my opinion it is less complicated and more reliable than the older design.

[WillieC]

Homemakers unite! I tried to get some help on how the heck one gets cables to work with various shifters and transmission throws. I had the MD3B Volvo Penta engine originally and swapped to the newer sexier MD17C with entirely different transmissions. The old worked by pulling from the south and the newer by pulling from the north with a vastly smaller throw. This ended up being a fun project where I was able to re-use my existing cables simply by fabbing a couple pieces to multiply the throw to mimic the original. It turned out to be a math problem.

You did well! Impressive.

[Plum76]

Has yet to be sea tested, but I think I'm happy with it, certainly a lot of constraints to be working in and around..

JP

Homemakers unite! I tried to get some help on how the heck one gets cables to work with various shifters and transmission throws. I had the MD3B Volvo Penta engine originally and swapped to the newer sexier MD17C with entirely different transmissions. The old worked by pulling from the south and the newer by pulling from the north with a vastly smaller throw. This ended up being a fun project where I was able to re-use my existing cables simply by fabbing a couple pieces to multiply the throw to mimic the original. It turned out to be a math problem.

You did well! Impressive.