Refrigeration A25

[Sunsetrider]

It won't be difficult for me to add batteries based on some initial experience in these northern waters before heading for southern climes.

[DesertAlbin736]

I believe Sunsetrider I setting up his 25 for a trip south to Florida and possibly even further south than that, so what works in Ontario may not be the same as what works in Florida . . . . or Panama

Being here in AZ I can tell you the A25 is not particularly well suited for excessively warm weather. Which is why the local boating season for us ends in May & doesn't start up again until October. Previous owners of our boat installed a digital indoor/outdoor thermometer in our cabin, which reads the forward cabin as "inside" and the cockpit as "outside" with the outside sensor located in that little glove box storage compartment under the dashboard. What ever the actual outside temperature is, the inside cabin & cockpit temperature is a good 10 degrees plus higher than outside ambient temperature. So if it's 80 outside, it's 90 to 95 in the cabin, even with all hatches and side curtains open. If it's 90 outside, which it is around here from late April on, it's over 100 in the cabin. As you can imagine, when the AZ summer desert temperatures reach 110 plus, it's over 120 in the cabin, which means you can stand it for about 5 minutes before getting heat exhaustion.

I've followed this thread with interest, as we don't have any refrigeration on our boat, and would miss the storage space in the opening in the port side wall just aft of the cabin door if it were taken up with a front load fridge as seen on many A25's. So what we've done for long duration cruising (up to our personal record of 46 consecutive days) is follow the Lin & Larry Pardey minimalist philosophy of keeping refrigerated items to a minimum & use a good "5 day" cooler & block ice for drinks, and an ice pick to chip chunks off the block ice for cubes as needed for drinks. One would have to buy a whole lot of ice to match the cost of installing powered refrigeration & the associated electrical system upgrades.

That said, when talking about external voltage regulators for engine alternators, we went with Mark Grasser's DC Solutions Smart Charge One regulator when I switched to AGM batteries, which need the the capability of bulk/absorption/float cycles to prevent overcharging and venting of irreplaceable electrolyte in these sealed AGM batteries.

http://markgrasser.com/regulator.htm

Here's a page with tips on cruising without refrigeration:

https://theboatgalley.com/refrigeration/

So in general what we do to provision for long cruises is:
Stock up with canned goods, canned tuna, salmon, chicken, beans, soups, packaged rice, egg noodles, instant mashed potatoes, etc.
Stop often for fresh provisions & block ice where available. In a good cooler with extra insulation block ice could last up to 4 days with ambient temps in the 70s.
For breakfasts mostly dry cereals, & boxed almond or pasteurized milk that doesn't need refrigeration until opened, in quart or smaller sizes.
For bacon & eggs, use pre-cooked bacon that doesn't need refrigeration, & "egg beaters". Or as noted in the above Boatgalley page, there's OvaEasy Crystal Egg brand powdered eggs. Haven't tried those yet, but supposedly they taste as good as fresh eggs. Not cheap though, on par with backpacker freeze dried meals, equivalent to $9 to $12 per dozen eggs.

And on and on.

[Sunsetrider]

The usual fridge spot opposite the helm is currently occupied by an awkward and difficult to access swing-down ice box. I just have to figure out the mechanics of building a slider in that space. Not my strong suit. I won't miss any storage space there, especially considering the voluminous aft cabin. But I can't see travelling without coolness for salad stuff, and more importantly, for certain of my meds (like insulin) which require refrigeration, considering it seems to be available on reasonable terms nowadays.

DA - your comments on the heat levels in southern climes certainly bears further consideration.

[Beta Don]

I've followed this thread with interest, as we don't have any refrigeration on our boat, and would miss the storage space in the opening in the port side wall just aft of the cabin door if it were taken up with a front load fridge as seen on many A25's. So what we've done for long duration cruising (up to our personal record of 46 consecutive days) is follow the Lin & Larry Pardey minimalist philosophy of keeping refrigerated items to a minimum & use a good "5 day" cooler & block ice for drinks, and an ice pick to chip chunks off the block ice for cubes as needed for drinks.

I'm trying to picture how the '5 day cooler' and block ice takes up less space than the little top loader Engel fridge Sunsetrider is thinking of using??

Ice is certainly cheaper, but block ice is not that easy to find when you're cruising and buying bags of crushed ice will be an almost daily necessity, even when using a good '5 day' cooler as crushed ice doesn't last that long - It quickly turns to water and the water melts the rest of the ice. Depending on where you are, there will be days when no ice is available and you'll end up tossing things which are spoiled. Not a good option for someone trying to keep medications cold

Refrigeration on a small boat is always a big decision, but it's much easier now with the use of the little top loading portable refrigeration units available these days. I'm 99% sure I wouldn't be interested in cruising as Larry & Lin did it. Lucky we have other options now in the modern era

Florida in the summer might not be too much fun - Never tried it. Most cruisers spend November to March in Florida waters and then head north to be away from the hurricane belt for the summertime

Don

[DesertAlbin736]

I may have to look into one of those portable drop in fridge units. We actually inherited one of those Coleman 12V plug in coolers that came with the boat which we use sometimes, depending on how long we're going to be out and if we're going to be docked with shore power, but it doesn't hold much. Most places we've cruised in, which I won't go into here, it hasn't been a problem finding block ice in most cases. We did cruise on the Chesapeake in late June & early July a couple years ago, but it was so hot & muggy we cut the cruise short at 2 weeks, even though we had trailered our boat all the way out from AZ. In that case you'd want not only refrigeration for food storage, but air conditioning as well. We could very well go to San Diego during summer, which stays mostly in the 70s and low 80s. But there and as with many other SoCal ports you pretty much have to stay in marinas with not many options to be on the hook. In which case we'd have shore power, making powered refrigeration more manageable.

I say that I would not like to lose that storage space opposite the helm because we've already taken up the space under the starboard bench seat with the battery bank relocated there when I installed a 20 gallon holding tank where batteries used to be. The other smaller under seat storage space on the port side is taken up with spare dock lines, water hose & bucket and extra fender, while the aforesaid space in the wall opposite the helm is taken up with engine spares, shore power cord, rode for the spare anchor, an emergency jump start battery pack, and a few other odds and ends. We already use the aft cabin for luggage, toolbox, a pair of big orange round ball fenders, and whatever else. Have to be careful not to put too much weight back there, as we're already a bit stern heavy with the dinghy hanging on davits.
Now all that said, if money were no object we'd have an Albin 36 trawler, or alternatively a CHB 34 or other similar trawler permanently docked in NW Washington, like Anacortes, Bellingham, Blaine, or somewhere in the San Juans for use as a summer home. But we're not that rich.

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride, and this would be my ride..

Albin 36.jpg

[dkirsop]

Here are some pictures of the installation in my boat. You can get some ideas on how it might work for you.

closed.jpg

open.jpg

12volt.jpg

epoxy.jpg

slide.jpg

tray.jpg

lock.jpg

The tray in my installation is raised as the previous owner had an extra set of batteries stored beneath it. When dockside power is available I use the plug above the fire extinguisher for power.

[Sunsetrider]

Wow - thanks so much dkirsop! Exposes the mystery behind the curtain. Those pics are a huge help.

[Beta Don]

Nice work!! What a well thought out, cleverly executed installation

Don

[DesertAlbin736]

dkirsop,

That is a very slick set up. Makes it tempting to replicate that as a project, although I'm still reluctant to give up that storage space. I especially like how you did 12V & 110AC outlets. The AC circuit is GFCI protected I assume? On our boat there's a plywood cover over the opening that doubles as a cockpit table which attaches to the aft cabin door & supported at the front end by a pipe strut.

This isn't the best picture, what with the lens flare and usual cluttered state of things, but it shows that same location on our boat and the plywood cover-slash-cockpit table. We usually just set the cooler under the driver seat. Previous owners installed web straps to hold the cooler in place, which we haven't removed. The round knob-like object near the upper rear corner of the opening is a jib sheet clam cleat, as this boat is set up for the sailing rig.

DSCN3673.JPG

The hinges were for a folding jump seat that previous owners used, which we felt was in the way & we removed. This photo below was from the previous owner's original for sale ad & shows the jumpseat and placement of the Coleman 12V cooler they used.

Albin Portside Cockpit.jpg

It's a hot one here today, already 96 degrees F (35*C) at 9:50AM local time, on the way to a high of 103, and we're only 5 days into May. Gonna be a long, hot summer. I'm going to check on the boat later (dry stored on the trailer), and I'm betting it'll be over 115 in the cabin by noon. What refrigeration could work in those conditions? But relief is on the way, a strong windy dry cold front due to arrive tomorrow, dropping our highs back down to upper 70s by Monday for a few days of comfort before the seasonal norm of 90s returns by next weekend. We were supposed to go out on the lake this weekend, but winds are forecast to hit 25-35 MPH with gusts to 40+, so that's out. But plans are to do an overnight on the lake on Monday when conditions are more civilized. That'll be our "season finale" for here at home until July when we go over to Catalina Island.

[DesertAlbin736]

This is slightly off track but tangentially related to refrigeration systems in the sense of how would one deal with, and what refrigeration system could handle heat like this? A quick trip over to the boat this afternoon, May 5, 2017 & a check of the inside cabin thermometer revealed this. 3:34 PM local time, outside ambient temp as measured by truck thermometer = 105 degrees. This display shows "Inside" as being forward cabin, "Outside" is the cockpit on the other side of the bulkhead. Not kidding, one can stand being in the cabin for about 5 minutes max when it's like this. Granted, the boat is closed up with all the windows covered, but we can't leave it open otherwise we'd have birds & other critters nesting inside, not to mention a coating of sand and dust on everything. Mold & mildew is the least our worries, as humidity stands at 10% & dew point of 35 degrees. This is pretty much why we hang up local "desert boating" for the remainder of summer after "Cinco De Mayo" & is the price we pay for being able to be out on the water practically all winter from November through April with hardly any days below 50 in the coldest months & don't have to be concerned with winterizing.

[dkirsop]

Credit for the design and installation goes to the previous owner. It is well thought out and executed and I thought it might provide ideas for others wondering how to install a chest freezer.

[Sunsetrider]

Now that I have seen how I might proceed to convert the port cavity to a fridge slide I have measured the available space. Good thing too. (picture of my existing ice box below). I have had my heart set on a dual-zone unit, which seems to be only Dometic 65DZUS and Whynter 62 quart, but each are much taller than the paltry 20 inches h I have available without sawing into the fiberglass at the bottom. Darnit. Existing box as shown is 20 h x 13.5 deep x 27w (I can go to 32 by removing the framing), with additional 4 available at the top where the hinged flap is. Looks like I have to begin the tedious searching anew and settle for a single zone. If I want to use the ice box space, which I do. Am I missing something?

[Sunsetrider]

Wait what? Perhaps I spoke too soon . . .

http://uniqueoffgrid.com/product/unique ... 60-litres/

My coding may not have worked.

[Beta Don]

That looks like a promising unit! - I wish I had gone with something like that instead of the unit I built. Less money and I'll bet it works better too

On another site, I see the manufacturer advertises a 38 AH draw for 24 hours under ideal conditions - 25C (77F) ambient temperature. I think you're going to want that second set of GC batts

Don

[Sunsetrider]

I hear you Don, and I intend to make a shelf below the fridge to accommodate them in the future. For now, I am spending, spending . . .